450. - Mac DeMarco

All right, this episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Stateside with Kai and Carter, a new podcast from The Guardian. And they are using this podcast to slow down the news and wrestle with the questions that we all have about what's happening in the world. And they do it three times a week, Jason. Does that sound familiar to you? We don't really talk about, you know, a lot of international global news items and climates and cultures and sports and things like that. We do talk about fashion and wellness, but for everything else, Kai and Carter are a great place. All right, so who couldn't use more news? Listen wherever you get your podcasts. or watch on YouTube. How long gone? Chris Black coming live from Stockholm where it's 8.45 p.m. I've had a full day of mobbing these clean, clean streets. Jason, you're just getting your day started, I assume? Yeah, I'm back like Pyre Moss hairline. I am in Glendale doing my thing. It feels wonderful to be home. Okay, well, I'm glad that you're home. I was a little jealous when I saw Carolyn post the Norma Tech recovery boots. That is kind of... what i'm missing over here in stockholm but i gotta say i am officially stockholm pilled okay how are you taking to the language barrier does everyone speak enough english for you to get around yeah totally everybody's good looking in shape food is good uh i mean hotel is food is good food is good yeah so barclay so i'm here to visit my our buddy barclay who moved here to work at byredo a couple years ago um and Yeah, he took me to a place called Cafe Nizza last night. It was amazing. And surprisingly, tonight for dinner, we went to a Brooklyn-style slice shop that was insanely good. You had some Brooklyn-style pizza first night in Stockholm. Okay, did you just get a regular plain cheese? They had multiple varieties, and I tried three different slices. It was delicious. Did you have any smoked trout ranch or anything like that? No, thank God there was no pickled herring on the pizza. Somehow...

Somehow we avoided that. You didn't have a pepperoni and dill? No, pepperoni and dill wasn't on the menu. Thank God. The sun was out today, which is rare, I think, this time of year. But it was very cool. His friends have a vintage store here called... Ettersex, E-T-T-R-E-S-E-X. Like ettersexual? I don't think so. I think it's probably some sort of kind of Scandinavian pronunciation that we're not doing properly. Okay. But I was very impressed. Okay, so this has been great so far is what you're saying. Yeah, man, I've had a great time. It's been really nice. I mean, besides having to work starting at 8 p.m. every night. It's been good, but the level of cleanliness and beauty here is truly staggering after being in London, which I love, but it's also a shithole in the same way that New York is. I don't know. I mean, London was pretty clean for me. I mean, well, yeah, except the venue we played in on the last night in town that smelled like a grandmother's undercarriage. My nan's bits. My nan's bits. I mean, I don't know how much I want to say on this podcast. Thank you, first of all, to our guest. Izzy Wood for being a good sport and being very funny with us. She really brought the British sense of humor that I think we needed. Yeah, we love her and all of our fans that came out on a Sunday night. You guys are all just adorable and sweet and so nice, and we loved all of you. There were some complications with our situation at the live show. No, let's get into it. Let's get into it. My girlfriend had to work the door. There was no staff whatsoever. And I was treated as if I was inconveniencing them by bringing a sold-out crowd to their audience to make them money. We showed up to the venue. and you know they're poking around listening to jamie xx which i felt like was a little a little on my nose if you have to ask me happy to hear it but yeah it is a little on the nose and then i was kind of like uh they're like who's who's working the door and i'm like why the fuck are you asking me that i'm here to perform i don't you know and they basically try to explain to me that somehow kind of our responsibility and that the promoter isn't there

And I was kind of like, well, this is a sold-out show, dude. I don't know what to tell you. I'm not working the door of my own show. Like, I'm not even trying to be a diva. I'm really not trying to be a diva. That's just weird. That doesn't work. And it's also kind of impossible to work the door. And also, like, do you want me to be the person? Like, it's your venue. Don't you care about who's inside? I could just let in a guy with a knife. Is that what you want? Everyone in there probably had a knife. So Carolyn is nice enough to volunteer to work the door. We do the show, and it's fine. We leave the stage. I'm downstairs looking for something. Jason goes upstairs with a few of our friends, Issy, et cetera. You guys are smoking a few cigs in this green room that's literally 400 years old and smells like piss, beer, and carpet. And the window is cracked. The window's fully open, I would say more than cracked. Fully open. And our friend, the representative of the club in question, he comes into the room, I'm not there, and apparently, luckily I wasn't, we might have come to blows, but apparently he starts getting very irate with you. Yeah, I mean, I'm starting to think that he just, he knew who we were and he hated us already, and we were just really ruining his life by doing a live show at the venue. I've been producing shows and performing at shows for a couple decades now at this point, and I have never seen shit like this in my entire life. And it was such a bummer, too, because it's a cute, amazing venue in a cool part of town, has so much history and all this stuff, and just treated like dirt. The show was fun. The show was fun. Everything went well, except for every time we had to interact with this person who worked at the venue. he gets mad at you guys and basically is freaking out, telling you to get out. Yeah, he was ordering us to go and sell merch because there were people in his bar buying alcohol and making money for the business that he runs. I think he was just like, I'm hungover and I don't want to work and I just want everyone to go home instead of be at this bar that sells alcohol in exchange for money.

keep your business up i don't understand like it was i've never been to a bar where the owner was like oh you sold it out completely um and i'm selling a bunch of alcohol fuck you for ruining my life it was so so deeply strange and then we're outside after we leave we rush out to get the fuck out of there i'm like we need to go before something bad happens and and then we're standing on the street talking to a few people and he comes out he's like if you have a drink you need to move and basically physically walks as close to them as he can so that they move until they're like one inch not in front of the club. Yeah, he told us that he didn't like that we were standing on the sidewalk on a public London street in front of the venue, you know, talking to a couple friends and fans, having a cigarette. And he didn't even want us to be near the venue, even though it's public. You know, it's just like me and a homeless guy who's asking me for a cigarette. I'm talking to him. And he's like, you guys can't stand here. I'm like, bro, just go home, bro. Just go home. What the fuck? No, it's truly on some fuck. Like, be done with it. Fuck you. Fuck that place. I'm never going back there. I've never dealt with it. Honestly, fuck you. It was insane. It was so insane on every level. And we made it out of London alive. We sold a lot of our limited edition tube hats. And we love London. We'll be back at a venue that actually is nice. Well, I don't think it's the venue's fault. I think it's just this one guy. Because everyone else there was cool. James, the sound guy. I don't give a fuck. The venue is a legendary spot. A lot of cool people play there. A lot of people love it. I think it was just this one guy that ruined it all. Well, I'm sorry. The whole ship is going down. Guilty by association. Yeah, it's like me and you. No, I mean, whatever. The show was so fun. I don't really care. The show was really fun. A gray cloud on an otherwise... I guess it was gray clouds the whole time in London, but metaphorically speaking, a gray cloud otherwise. Yes, yes. Really lovely trip out to London, and thanks to all the new friends that we made out there. And, you know, from Izzy to Alexa and everyone in between really made us feel special and at home.

I wish we had time to hang out with all of you guys. Well, not Chris as much, but I do. That's not true. I felt like we were doing a speed dating thing where I was like, here you go, nice to meet you. Take a photo, boom, boom, boom. I wanted to build a little bit more. I'd like to say, when we were selling that merch, I was doing it with you, talking to everyone. I just want to be clear about that. Don't act like I was... hiding somewhere okay i was i was carrying i'm not i'm not i was carrying my weight and being and by weight i mean you were a pocket full of of pounds um because we were accepting cash only thanks to limited use of venmo in in the uk and eu but i'm just look i'm glad you made it home because i know that you were probably you needed it you were looking by the after the show you i was like jason's had it he's hit the wall He's hit the wall, and he needs to go recharge his batteries. And I understand. I totally get it. And I'm hoping that those batteries are a little recharged now because we have a guest today. So we've got to kind of, you know, we're back at it, as they say. No more messing around. Luckily, our guest is a chill bro that I'm excited to talk to. But, yeah, I mean, I was able to come back, went straight to Fish King. Got my fish, my friend who works there. I guess he's not a friend. He's just like a 60-year-old guy named Joe. But he's like, oh, you're just in London, huh? Did you order any fish and chips? And I was like, yes, I did. Your fish is better, but their chips are better. And then the owner kind of gave me a little side-eye look, and I was like, bros, I'm sorry. French fries are just a billion times better there. I don't know what to tell you, chief. And, you know, I did that, had a good night's sleep. Went to the gym. I had a sauna this morning. I'm having a smoothie. This is everything I need. Let me ask the question. Mark Maron was at the gym again. Let me ask the question we're all wondering. How good was the loud when you finally got to touch it? Bro, I didn't even need half a bong. Didn't need.

Half a bong. I was just gone. You went Frankenstein mode after one little pull from the pipe. Yeah, yeah. Luckily enough, I came home, hit the showers. Bay loaded up a little in the bong. And it was just a little baby hit, you know? Just a little something to take the edge off. And that full blast off. Just adios, mamma mia. Which I love. Let me tell you what. I'm getting a phone call right now from SiriusXM. Are they looking to sell you something? Literally 10 minutes ago, whenever you buy a car, new or used or anything like that, Sirius XM is on your ass more than if you have a bench warrant for murder. I literally came home from the gym today, opened my mail, there's an envelope from Sirius XM, I throw it in the trash, I'm doing a podcast. They've called me every week. Send me mail every week since I've got this car. It's amazing that used cars work that way. I didn't know that, but that's good to know because those guys at Sirius, hopefully they're going to start calling us for a new reason now. You know what I mean? Because I'm trying to host kind of like a 90s alternative show. I'm not. I have a bad taste in my mouth from SiriusXM right now. I know you're upset. I'm going to stop listening to Outlaw Country. If you guys call me one more time, I swear to God I'm going to stop listening to Outlaw Country using my free subscription. All right. We do have a guest today, a longtime popular musician that we are both fans of, which I don't know how we haven't. I've met him once or twice, but I feel like he's really in our orbit, and it's strange that we haven't met him. Yeah, it's one of those situations where we have a zillion billion mutual friends, and we've been in a zillion billion places together. But yeah, we never really hung out or built, but he has a new album that is truly right up my alley. It's instrumental. To me, it was sounding like it was giving the Virgin Suicide soundtrack. Oh, okay.

Yeah, hold on. We're finishing our intro. We're finishing up the intro really quick. No, no, no. Don't sweat it. It happens all the time. Just give us like 60 seconds and don't listen. Turn your ears off. Yeah, the album is instrumental. It's called Five Easy Hot Dogs, which is a very cool name. I actually didn't know this. He's Canadian. Did you know that? Maybe. I guess we'll find out where in Canada he's from. Duncan, Canada? Mino, no. Mino, no. But yeah, he lives in L.A. now, I believe. We're going to find out. Anyway. He spent the last couple, all over the world recording this record, and I think it's a special thing, and I think that it's just in time for me because this is the kind of music that I really like to listen to, and it came at a right time. I was able to listen to Mac DeMarco at the gym, which is something that... Just me and Maren listening to the new Mac. All right, yeah, let's give Mac a Zoom. I can't wait to chat with him. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by a new podcast from The Guardian stateside with Kai and Carter. This is covering a lot of our bases, Jason. It's trying to slow down. The news and wrestle with the questions we all have about what's happening in the world. And I know you particularly have quite a lot of questions. A lot of questions. But how often? Because we do this podcast three times a week and that's a sweet spot. How many times do they do? Three times a week. And I have a feeling just based on the platform and these talking points that they're maybe going to be covering different stuff than we do. That's just a guess. The Guardian is not some billionaire owned. They're not afraid to say what they want to say, brother. Yeah, Rupert ain't sniffing around in what journalists Kai Wright and Carter Sherman are up to over there at Stateside. But yeah, listen wherever you get your podcast. You can watch it on YouTube. It's three times a week. And who couldn't use more news? Especially when it's not from here, let's say. Give it a listen. Give it a listen. Oh, this is huge for me personally. This episode of How I'm Gone.

It was brought to you by TaskRabbit. Oh, baby, let me tell you something. This is not a joke. I use TaskRabbit a lot because I can't do anything. You need some art hung? TaskRabbit. You need something put together? A cabinet? Got to reach that cheese grater on the top shelf? TaskRabbit. Anything you need, TaskRabbit can take care of it for you. How it works, TaskRabbit connects you with skilled taskers in your area. They can help you move. They can assemble furniture, repairs, yard work, mounting, and more. You can search for a tasker based on cost, skill set, availability, and past client reviews so you know exactly who's showing up and can have confidence that they know what they're doing because taskers have assembled over 3.4 million pieces of furniture, completed 700,000 home repairs. handled 1.5 million moves, and the numbers are just going up, Jason. Yeah, throw a little money at the problem. It's not so expensive, and that job that you really don't want to do is something that another person out in the world is very good at doing and would gladly do it in exchange for a little bit of money. So when life happens, your to-do list grows. Get ahead of it now and get $15 off your first task at TaskRabbit.com or grab the TaskRabbit app using promo code how long taskers book up faster, especially for same-day tasks. So book trusted home help today. That is $15 off your first task using promo code howlong with the TaskRabbit app or at TaskRabbit.com. This episode of How Long Gone is brought to you by Squarespace. Obviously, Jason, you and I spend a lot of time on the World Wide Web, sort of our peers, our listeners, our friends, our colleagues, maybe even your parents if they're freaky. And if you're doing anything in the world, writing, taking pictures. I do topless boxing. You need a website. Exactly, a website that works, that does what it's supposed to do, that allows you to be creative but also business-minded. Jason, there's one place to go for that, Squarespace. Yeah, Chris, I'm over here. I'm modifying calculators and putting Claude inside of them so you could cheat at school. And I just want a place where I could have everything all in one place. I can have the SEO tools.

So those future graduates can find me and, you know, I'm able to accept, quote, unquote, donations for my services that might be gray area. You know what I mean? And then email campaigns. Hey, I got a new, you know, 2.3 version upgrade. Boom, boom, boom. Get the analytics going. Raise some money. You know, show your investor all of your cool analytics of what's going on. They're going to want to get in early. And we can use Blueprint AI to make your website look as professional. as your competition, if not more. So head to squarespace.com slash howlong for a free trial. When you're ready to launch, use offer code howlong to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or a domain. I'm in my garage in LA. Oh, shit. So the garage is finished then? It's got carpet and stuff? Yeah, well, it's like a recording studio, but I call it a garage. You know, a lot of people hear like convert a back house or something to a, you know, something like this. So I have one of these. Actually, it's weird. I have these contractors. I told them I wanted cork floors. You know how some people put cork down, and it's fancy. It looks nice. Looks good. Sounds even better. That's true, but they kind of use the kind of cork that I think you'd use for a bulletin board, so it looks kind of cheap and falls apart. But I have carpets over it, so it's okay. Okay, so you're saying because they didn't use the proper cork, you kind of had to cover it with something of your liking. It's the wrong cork, but it's fine. Who cares? Hey, we're getting there, bro. It's tough to find good contractors, Matt. It's tough. Jason, I've dealt with it as well. And it's something that comes with home ownership, and I don't wish it on my worst enemy. My vibe with it, because these guys, right now they're sanding the hell out of this front room in my house. It's like, I've been working with the same guys for so long. They've really given her. Oh, they're giving it, yeah, they're giving it hell. But I've been working with them for so long that I feel like now we're getting to the point where they're fixing things.

that they did kind of bad the first time, but it's okay, because we're, like, learning together, and, like, they're getting better, and they see what we like, and it's almost like, you know, I have a foreman or a contractor or whatever, but I kind of have to oversee him. It's a whole pain in the ass, but, right, we had a revelation, speaking of floors yesterday, because I had all this maple that I wanted to put into maple floors. I'm from Canada. You got to use the tree that, you know. Let's go. That's nice. That's a nice touch. That's a nice touch. You know what I'm saying? You know, you got to keep it northern, you know what I'm saying? But, But they pulled up the floor that they had put in when I bought the house like six years ago or something. And the original hardwood was under it. And I was like, why did you put this goddamn, like this, like, why did you put this Home Depot floor on top of this? Like, what the fuck? But, you know, it's a blessing in disguise because now at least those are there and we can do that. But it's, yeah, baby steps. I like the idea that you're, the relationship that you've built with them over the years now where they're like, at first we were just like, fuck you, but now we kind of like you. And we feel bad about doing a bad job before, so we're going to quietly fix all our errors where we fucked you before? Well, it's just like I'm paying them twice. for the same one good job now we're finally doing it yeah you're paying twice for one good job but it's you know this guy i love this guy and his kids i remember when we first started working we had all these kids they'd be playing in the pool now they've all grown up and they work now they're all working for him so it's kind of oh that is nice actually that is nice that was a nice way to reveal that you have a pool as well exactly that's true What part of Mount Washington are you in? Mount Washington? I'm in Silver Lake, my friend. You do strike me as one of the original Silver Lake settlers. You know what? When I moved here, I think it already kind of felt like an indie rock retirement community. It's kind of like Ed from Grizzly Bears right down the street, and there's Tobias, Jess O'Junior.

not saying those guys are all still doing the thing i'm not you know but i'm just saying no sure i kind of moved in i was like wow it's like like i feel like ed is for example i don't know if you know who ed is but he's a singer from grizzly bear and he uh yes of course yeah i love ed and uh he's i think he's been here for a long time but he's beautiful i don't know that's cool but it's weird i i'll tell you this recently because i moved here six years ago something like that and i was kind of i'm scared of silver lake you know it's like there's a lot of cool this me too a lot of people So I don't want to go to the restaurant. I went to the restaurant one time, you know, and it was kind of like one of the restaurants in the zone. Wait, hold on. What is the restaurant, if you don't want me asking? Well, that's the thing. That's the thing is you can just say the restaurant because all the restaurants are kind of the same. All the restaurants are the restaurant. We kind of know. You don't even have to say it. It's like the young kind of like, well, you know, it's like, you know, like, I don't know, somebody in their late 30s like opened a brick and mortar. It's like we have buffalo cauliflower wings. Like, okay, I see. I get it. Okay, so like a Mohawk Bend situation. Exactly. That's the one I went to. That's exactly. Because at first I was leading Botanica, but then, yeah, you went a little Mohawk, like where they spent more money on the Marquis sign. See, no, Botanica is where I'm at now. See, Mohawk band scared me at first, and I was kind of like, I don't know about this. I'd rather go get Chinese food in San Gabriel Valley or something. I was trying to keep it real. I didn't walk around the reservoir. I barely even walked in the neighborhood. I don't get coffee at the store. I don't do these things. But now... But now recently, I have been walking around the reservoir. I ate at Botanica recently. I did the LaMille coffee. I'm becoming like Silver Lake guy. It's kind of crazy. Okay, so Mac did the work and now you're ready to become the person that you deserve to be a Silver Lake resident who's coming out of his shell and he's doing just fine. Yeah, it's crazy. Well, you know, there's things like there's rules. You know, like when you walk around the lake, it's like you do not say hello to anybody. Oh, is that actually, is that like an understood thing among the community? I didn't know that. I think so.

i mean because i was always like i was like i don't want to walk around the fucking lake like god forbid run around the lake i don't want to see somebody fucking see me doing that it's fucking embarrassing i got a reputation for crying out loud well i just got it i got like kind of like a buttery like childish looking body it's disgusting you know so it's like like a parker house role yeah exactly you know i don't want to see somebody like oh well there he goes trying to fix that problem it's like oh you know max trying it's nice to see yeah he's trying you know but the what the walking at least the walking is okay but it's yeah but i was worried like oh god some jackass with his dog is gonna and every once in a while someone will say what's up but but no i mean maybe nobody gives a fuck that might be the actual reality like you know but um I don't know. It's peaceful. It's nice. I don't know. It's weird. You see all the same weird characters. I'm a real neighborhood guy. What can I say? No, I think you really have to lean into it and just like, you know, I bought a house here for some reason. I might as well enjoy it, my home. Yeah, it's weird. It's all good. I mean, I haven't walked around the reservoir in so long. I used to jog around the reservoir. That's how long I've lived around here. Jesus Christ. The thought of doing that now, like you just said, is a little loco. Mac, trust me. If you think you look weird jogging, Jason looks weirder. Well, maybe we should jog together then, have a whole thing. I agree. I agree. Mac, I would love to see you over at the Glendale Equinox one day. Glendale. Oh, that's the... No, see, here's the thing. Okay, I'll say this, because you guys know Sam Salad from... meals he put this all together there you know i'm saying he introduced us all shout out to meals clothing shout out to meals clothing um sam no sam and i we go or he doesn't go anymore but we used to go to the anderson munger you know because everybody goes this equinox everybody goes But no, the Anderson Munger YMCA in K-Town, that. Okay. I've never heard of what that is. I've never heard of – is there a pool? Is that – and full court basketball? There's a pool. Sam used to swim the pool every day, he said. He swam it for years and years. I don't know how many years, but he did a lot. I was going quite a bit. I haven't been in a while now that I'm obsessed with Silver Lake. You can't leave. It used to be different, man. You used to go to SGV and have –

Interesting Szechuan cuisine, bro. What happened to you? I know. I know. I don't know what happened to me. I don't know. But I like the Anderson Munger. I like that. It's nice. They got the treadmills. They got the... They got like a dance aerobics class. It's like a lot of older Korean grandmas and stuff. That's a good place. It's $50 a month. $50 a month. I love the grandma in the pool doing the aerobics. Oh, yeah. Taking up some real estate in the lanes, but you don't mind because they're having such a nice time. Oh, yeah. You can't beat the pricing of the YMCA. You really can't. The crowd. No. The one I used to go to in New York, the crowd was a little too interesting for me. But the pool scene, I did see some violence break out over lane issues. Oh, really? Lane drama is real. There'd be some tussling and some harsh words exchanged among 50-year-old Bernie-supporting lawyers. I only have eight minutes to do these laps, bro. Someone will grab someone's goggles. Yeah, because it was a speed issue. There'd be somebody in there going a little too slow in the fast lane, and there would be some touching. you know, inadvertent that would turn into purposeful. It's like driving in Italy. None of that. None of that at the Anderson Munger. Anderson Munger is very, it's a mellow, it's a mellow YMCA. It's a civilized, civilized way. I went to the YMCA in Rockaway too. That was a little, no, that was also a mellow in Rockaway Beach, New York. All my experiences, I also grew up in a YMCA after school care. I loved YMCA. Shout out. To the YMCA. Oh, so you go deep. Okay. I hope you're donating. I hope you're donating some profits to them as well and not just talking. I guess I should get on that. Yeah, maybe you could do some type of YMCA tiny something concert. I don't know. I don't think they have desks there. i would love yeah that'd be we're pitching this as a fundraiser ymca kiddie pool concert i could see it now that's not npr doesn't need any more money those guys are so rich off of their podcasts but the ymca they need a buck live from the sauna or something or live live from the sauna you know how much it costs to heat a fucking pool yeah so when did when did your um when did your new album come out how long ago was it uh i think two weeks ago or something like that i'm not sure okay i was just listening to it today at the gym oh that's nice that is nice it put

me in a nice a beautiful relaxing peaceful mood i usually listen to just like ambie and her classical and try to do some type of patrick bateman zone out kind of thing and i was able to achieve that with your album some people like a like a kind of a more hard-hitting kind of mechanical uh like a pump it up kind of music but i mean yeah i think i'm in the same boat as you i like something a little uh more um soothing When you're getting your pump on. Soothing and cerebral. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. The pump is happening inside of my brain. It doesn't need to happen inside of my pods. That's true. I wish I could relate. I'm glad it worked out in there. That's the first time anybody's told me that they've listened to it in the gym, which is great. That's nice. I was saying earlier, but it reminded me of the Virgin Suicide soundtrack a little bit. Are you familiar with that? From Air? Is that the one that has... Oh, yeah. What is that? It has Air on it? Is that right? Yeah, I think Air did most... Oh, it's Sofia Coppola, right? She made it? Yeah, yeah. Sofia Coppola. A classic film. It's one of those soundtracks that everybody gets a little Randy for, I think. Is that correct? Yeah, yeah. If you're like a Tumblr-y girl... Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, baby. I'm Randy. Well... But yeah, we had the singer of Phoenix on, and he's the one who sings Playground Love. You know, funny thing about those Phoenix guys is that they took us on tour almost 10 years ago. Oh, shit. So this is full circle moment. Yes. How do you say exactly in French? I don't know. Exactement. Yeah, something like that. But no, those guys are very sweet guys. That's kind of the only real support tour we ever did with my band. But nice guys. Oh, yeah. Nice. Great. It was cool to talk to a guy who's like, I'm way too sexy, French, and rich to be talking to you, but I'm still going to play around with you just for fun kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. What a great sport. He was more of a sport than I expected. Did you say that's the only support tour you've ever done? Pretty much, yeah. We did a tour with the Flaming Lips once, but it was kind of like co-headline sort of.

It felt kind of like their tour because they come out with inflatable unicorns and fucking shit blowing all over the venue and stuff. They got a lot of props, so it kind of felt like their thing. But we also played a full hour. Yeah, it was like, you know. But I guess there was that. We'll do support slots. We play with the Strokes a couple times. It's always fun. yeah i don't know not really like uh speaking of randy that's a good place to be is what i'm saying that sounds perfect not doing support tours yes support tours suck yeah yeah it's horrible they don't care about you and you get paid less it just doesn't really add up you know yeah but you but isn't that negated by not having to carry any responsibility like they're going to be there whether or not you're there and there's some freedom to that maybe there is a bit of freedom but it's also like uh i remember that phoenix tour like nobody really knew who we were at the time and like i think A couple of the Phoenix guys were like, oh, they really liked my album called Rock and Roll Nightclub. And they brought me. It was kind of a gamble. You know, they had this big record. They're bringing this, like, unknown indie kid. But some of their fans were not. pleased like i remember that's right kids in the front row just like you know just sleeping on the barricade or just like knitting yeah reading poetry i remember there was one instance actually my my this guy pierce used to play with me a long time ago and his girlfriend ashley was in the crowd and she was right in the front like like okay guys like play this and she was trying to hype the people around her up right in front of the crowd there was this girl that's sweet um this girl uh standing right on the barricade beside her, and she had her headphones in, and Ashley was like, what are you listening to? And she pulled her... she pulled her headphones out and like kind of looked at her and then lifted her sweater and she was just wearing a phoenix shirt and was like fuck off and i was like okay i'm so sorry but uh but yeah she's like listening to phoenix in her headphones while wearing a shirt waiting for phoenix to come on stage i mean it's not wow that's not like we're at a metallica concert and fucking taylor swift is opening it's like here's two rock and roll bands exactly you know i think it was you know

But it was a good time. Well, you know, the French can be a certain way. Where in Canada are you from? I didn't realize you were Canadian. I am. I was born in a place called Duncan in British Columbia, which is on Vancouver Island. Oh, you're a BC guy. Well, kind of. I was born there in like Seanigan Lake is what it's called, this area that my mom and dad were in. Sounds beautiful. It is. It's pretty nice. You know what they have? I went out there while I was recording this hot dog, 5Z Hot Dogs record. I went out there again to see my Uncle Ted. I hadn't seen him in years. They have all these schools out there. It's kind of like Xavier's school for gifts, like the X-Men Academy. All these fancy international schools. It's kind of like Hogwarts or something. All these kids flying from all over the world and they live at these beautiful... Me and my uncle were driving around the campuses. He's like, ah, pretty crazy. I'm like, yes. fucking strange this is where they are this is where canada's finest quirked up shouties go to university straight up i guess so it's very strange yeah it's i didn't know about that but anyway so that little fun fact but the thing is i was born out there but i grew up in edmonton alberta uh which is like the next province over Not quite as... That's the Orange County of Canada. I've been there. Yeah, yeah, I could... Yeah, you could... Yeah, some people... Raised trucks, oil money. Oh, yeah, big time. Alcoholism. Oh, yeah. A little dash of racism. Wayne Gretzky. That's who we got. Oh, Wayne Gretzky's from there. He's the only... Wayne Gretzky. You and Wayne, the only good... He's not from there, but he took the Oilers. He took the Oilers all the way. He didn't invent. We love Wayne. But he did perfect Edmonton, didn't he? He did. He did. There's statues. They renamed some streets after him and shit. You know what is interesting? I don't know if this is... I always was under the impression when he left the team there and went to play for L.A. I don't know a lot about hockey, but I thought everyone was pissed off at Wayne. Like, wow, could you leave us, Wayne? You made us. And to go to a Los Angeles hockey team. Yeah. But apparently, all of that hatred got dumped on the general manager. And I don't know if it was like...

Because I'm sure Wayne wanted to get the fuck out of Edmonton. Who the fuck wants to? Like, that's insane. Especially if you're that kind of hockey player. Like, you can't even move around the city. Like, everyone's coming at you. It's all we got up there. Hey there, Wayne. In L.A., he can drive his Ferrari down the street and nobody knows who the fuck he is. Nobody gives a fuck. Exactly. So it's like, I always wonder, like, if Wayne was maybe, you know. He was like, I want to go to L.A., but we're going to make the GM take the heat. I bet the GM couldn't pay him enough and was willing to take the L publicly. Yeah, maybe. For the betterment of Wayne. I bet he respected Wayne that much. Everybody. Wayne Gretzky may have gaslit the GM. Maybe. I don't know. To make it seem as if it was his fault when it was Wayne's the whole way. Maybe. I mean, it's like even now. We have this new kid up there, this kid, Connor McDavid. He's the new great one. He's amazing. But it's like you can't. Oh, yeah, Connor. These hockey players, it's like a curse playing for the Edmonton Oilers because the people in Edmonton love it so much. Yeah, you can't do jack shit. I mean, you make a shitload of money. But I think hockey players just want to go play in Florida. Then you don't got to pay taxes and nobody gives a fuck about you. That's a good point. That's a good point. Where do you go in Edmonton to find these hockey players? Where are they hanging out? Were you crossing paths with them at the local steakhouse? I think that if you're of a certain ilk, I don't know. For example, when Wayne and Mark Messier and these guys were on the Oilers in the 80s, my mom had a friend, her friend Candice. Let's just say she knew where to find the hockey players. She's got all these stories. When I was a kid too, I would go down to the basement. My mom paints quite a bit. she'd have all these paintings of these guys with mullets and i was like this guy looks like a fucking hockey player and it's like you know i think i think my mom was hanging out with some of these fucking others too but i don't know i don't know nowadays i don't know they they wait wait wait wait wait wait hold on are you saying that your mom was a puck bunny i don't know i don't know you know you're gonna have to ask her i don't know

These are answers that maybe I don't want to know the answer to. See, it's cool because whenever I've heard Chris say the phrase puck bunny, the person on the other end of it is like, what the fuck are you talking about? But Mac just instantly knew exactly what you're talking about. Oh, yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah, of course. I mean, there used to be this sports bar, Barry T's. I think you can catch some Oilers down at Barry T's. But now it's a place called The Ranch. But, I mean, the whole downtown of my home. hometown they like they revamped it but now it's called the ice district and they like they used to be it's full like it's full and it used to be the ice district but like methamphetamine i mean there's parts of it that still are definitely definitely that kind of ice yeah a little icy oh yeah baby so you're speaking of ice you're you're kind of on the you're on the straight edge nowadays still is that are we are we holding tight yeah uh yeah i guess so i stopped drinking when covid began just kind of My way of thinking about it is I only drink when I'm at work, and then work stopped, so there was no reason to drink. And then work kind of just kept being stopped for years, and I was like, oh, I guess I don't drink anymore. I like this. Yeah, I mean, that happened to me as well. That happened to me as well. But I don't know. i i don't i don't think i was like chemically addicted to drinking or anything i was like oh whatever you know maybe i'll drink again someday i don't know but for now i'm not doing it i don't think you were chemically addicted but you sort of have a national duty as a canadian to be able to put them back right well i was like an olympian like an olympic drinker like very powerful for there was like a stretch you know and i think the kids witnessed it too it's like you know my fans i was doing like a two-six of Jameson every night on stage, you know, just down the hatch. And it became this thing. And it, you know, it was kind of, some kids were like... Yeah, that's the problem. They want it. They want it from you. Oh, they want it. They want it. And even though I'm like, by the end of the show, I couldn't even fucking stand up. It's a mess. You know, it's like, what do you, you know, but that's what they're coming to pay for. See, my question for you is, this is always what's so interesting to me about musicians, is that you can, you're doing that every night and your set is not suffering to the fan.

They can't tell, you can't tell, or you can tell, but you don't care because you're drunk. I think that, well, by the time that stuff really starts rocking it, I mean, there were times where you could, I don't know, we don't really, you know, like the idea of a set list, that was never really much of a thing. And we would kind of just start playing whatever. So it's like, sometimes you come to a Jameson show and it'd be like, wow. like that was the strangest funniest we did amazing like you know all those weird songs they play incredible you know sometimes you get a good experience sometimes i remember there was this one in la where we were doing this residency at this place and like somewhere in the middle of the show like i was in my underwear like just standing on my amp i had everybody in the crowd sitting down i made everyone completely silent i started putting cigarettes out of my chest and it was like a bad scene and then this young girl okay so so we're kind of tiptoeing into the gg allen world yeah it's uh well not quite gg but i think just kind of like you know like welcome to my drunken fantasy or whatever but it's or am i you know my drunken hell but it's but i remember one girl just stood up in the middle of everybody and she just went she was crying and she went what the fuck are you doing That was a particularly bad one. I remember I woke up the next morning and my mom called. She's like, sweetheart, what's happening? It's fair to say that I had an alcohol problem. Honey, I read on Pitchfork that you had a bit of a night last night. The stereo gum email came at 8 a.m. I've been to shows like that where it's like drinking is a part of the show it's like the shared experience between the performer and the audience and you you kind of egg each other on and when you're in the crowd like as long as you can understand and recognize what song is playing yeah it just doesn't matter that's kind of all you need and you're nobody's going to be like oh actually you missed that note on that 14th scale there on that oh that is more of a six seven swing yeah that's not even in our universe nobody gives a rat i mean because well you know i don't know

It's sloppy. Well, there's times where we can play pretty good, but I think we're rooted in sloppiness, especially on stage. The music lends to it. Jason and I saw the Lemonheads open for Jawbreaker, and that was the first time I think I can remember, as a person who's been going to shows since he was like 12 years old, that I was like, wow, these guys are terrible. they're terrible because they're so fucked up oh yeah like it's awful and i think there's like there's there's a charm well it is sometimes it is awful but there's a charm to shittiness that i think shit shittiness is back on the ups i think i think it's coming back because right now the past couple years it's been like you know like kids on instagram that are like so good at guitar that like jimmy hendrix is like rolling around his grave or whatever you know it's like and everyone's like hell yeah like there's just no one's been writing songs for like four years like there's just no bands left it's just these like career instagram musicians which is like tiktok noodlers yeah exactly which is cool but it's also kind of i think we're getting to the point where it's kind of like whoa like i yeah it's like you stop having any kind of emotional uh you know connection to music you're just like holy shit like that is he can play so many notes like that's not music yeah it's not music it's just you know so i think that you know Crap. Hopefully crap will come. Because when I was like 18, it was like, I didn't give a rat's ass about Ying Wee Malmsteen playing fucking sweet picking like our guitar arpeggios. Like I want it to be beat happening or something. I was like, you know, it's like, oh, no, no, no. Perfection is not cool. I agree. I agree. I agree. It's not cool. But here's the other thing. I think maybe the bigger picture is like maybe. you know maybe cool is just gone like what is cool these are the these are the tough this is what keeps me up at night mac this is what keeps me up at night there's just not a lot of cool there's a lot of not cool like so much so easy to find it but uh i think i think nowadays everyone i mean people have like cool has been lowered on the list of priorities because

You know, it's taken a backseat to mental health or literally just survival. Yeah. In these trying times that we're living in. True, true, true, true, true. I can't afford to be cool. But back when we were youngsters, like, you were cool if you couldn't afford. Yeah, exactly. That's kind of the whole point of it. Yeah, that's true. You make something. I think it's, yeah. Now everybody's very concerned with getting the bag. And I think that... Money is great because then money makes life easier. But also, like, fuck the bag. No, you have to coordinate the pool guy and the lawn service. It becomes a headache. It's horse shit. The pool guy was just fucking here. Unbelievable. I'm afraid I'm not cool anymore. Yeah, if he thinks he's getting a Christmas bonus this year, he's got another thing coming. I do think you're right. I think you're right to an extent. But I think that, like, I think... I think there's no such thing as selling out anymore, so that changes the whole thing. We talk about it a lot, but that's what changes everything, is that anyone from any genre of music or art form in general can basically be absolutely upfront about wanting more money than anything else, and no one cares. That's funkadelic. It's very strange. It is quite funkadelic, but also back then, you had to make good music and be cool. Just to get your foot in the door. Now you don't have to do either of those things. And now you don't have to do either of those things. It used to be a prerequisite. And now whenever you come across somebody who is authentically cool, like truly cool, instead of that being celebrated, they're kind of observed under a microscope of like. How did you do this? Who are you? Where did you come from? And you squeeze the babies until it dies. It's just like, well, I don't want to be cool anymore. This fucking is weird. Yeah, it's true. It's a strange world we live in. I was just in a room with three very cool 25-year-olds. Yeah. And I was really taking it all in. I was like, these guys really have their whole lives in front of them. It was really, I was...

I was kind of guilty of what you're saying, Jason. I was observing them like they were rats in a cage. But that's because when we were 25, even if we thought we were cool, we just weren't, you know? That's right. That's right. I sucked when I was 25. Mac, are you still doing marijuana or were you ever a big smoker? I never was a weed. You know, that's like the most common misconception about me, I think, is that kids like... they think my music is like psychedelic and they're like hell yeah dude like yo man like you want to come roast this after the show in the alley and there was a point where i like kind of i was like oh damn like oh i'm good right now bro like years like 10 years ago and people would throw like bags of weed on stage and shit and i'd be like because i would always have bandmates that would smoke or whatever but now i've definitely like gone more into the lane of like um like no i don't smoke like i'm sorry i'm not a hippie like you know it's like i don't And I never did. I really never smoked. But I don't have a problem with it. There's certain situations where calling someone a hippie for smoking weed is like – I get a real kick out of it. That sounds very fun. And I've been called – a friend of mine named Mikey, he'll do that. He'll just call me a hippie for smoking weed. Yeah. Which is fine, but I mean, if somebody was like, here's a picture of Mac DeMarco, gun to your head, does this guy smoke weed, or does he think that you're a hippie if you smoke weed? I'm going to guess. They'll probably think I smoke weed. Yeah, that's right. And the music lends... I used to smoke a hell of a lot of cigarettes. That was the one that I left behind, and that was incredibly hard to stop doing. The toughest one. I know this is fairly recent for you. Did you get hypnotized? No, no, no. I just did Cold Turkey. It was while I was making the Five Easy Hot Dogs record. I just decided one day...

Well, I was in New York, and I was leaving New York. I was going to drive to Utah, and I was like, I'm going to go live in Salt Lake City for a month and record. That was my plan. Well, the only thing to do there is smoke cigarettes. Yeah, exactly. But I got into Pennsylvania, and I was like, you know what? I'm going to quit smoking today. And I just put him down, and yeah, I thought it would be like four hours of discomfort, and then I'd be like, wow, I'm a free man now. But it was like three weeks of absolute lunacy. Really? Wow, it was horrible. fucking horrible. What was your brand? Marlboro Red. Oh, yeah. That's a tough one. The cowboy killer. Well, okay. You have a lot of work to undo. What were you reaching for? What kind of gummy worms were you eating to kind of curb those cravings? You know what I was doing was those fucking Vicks VapoRub nasal tube things. Oh, Jesus. Jesus. Yeah, I used to steal those and then just suck on those things when I was on ecstasy. Yeah. What a treat. Yeah, those things. I would also do the... I still do the fucking tea tree oil toothpicks, but they kind of fuck my lips up. Yeah, that's a good one. classic yeah they like they would they would kind of get a little burny if you did it too much they just my shit gets chapped up i don't know it's it's kind of like yeah this is my whole thinking of like i'm gonna you know getting rid of the cigarettes is like i want to be free from this fucking thing you know it's like so annoying you know but then you just replace it with this getting those fucking tea tree you got to go to whole foods or something to get that it's even more annoying than having to get the fucking cigarettes you know it's like yeah it's way more annoying it's way more annoying it really is you got to bond by the case yeah it's fucked up so it's i i don't know i Now I don't really do any of them, but I want to get as far away from all this crap as possible. It ain't easy, brother. Do you think that your body subconsciously told you that you have to drive alone to Utah in order to kick something? maybe cigarettes maybe whatever get your album started or whatever it is yeah maybe i think it's just like that whole the whole like i'm just gonna leave i don't know where i'm gonna go i'm on this like uh

you know sometimes i get into this mode where i start going like i'm gonna figure i'm gonna leave i'm gonna go figure it out when i come back i'll understand everyone's like yeah okay pal like you're fucking out of your mind you know but then i go max moving to chile again guys yeah exactly you know what i mean it's like well we'll see you know here we go and i think that was just part of it it's like you reach you know i got used to traveling around and just sleeping wherever and fucking just you know doing this like a nomad weirdo thing and then it was kind of like well how can i kick it up a notch again it's like well you know quit smoking and that'll fucking throw you a bone or two so so i did but it kind of ended up ending my trip which was uh not exactly the outcome i was looking for but whatever so you went to utah did you know someone was there a person you were going to work with there or did you just pick it on a map no no no i went um the whole well we had the next thing i had booked with my band was like we were headlining this festival this like block party thing they had in utah and it was in a month so i was gonna go okay i was gonna stay there for the month and i was gonna do this fucking thing and then i don't know and then i'd keep going after that so but i got to salt lake and i was like okay and i i played salt like once in like 2008 or something so it was a long time ago and uh and i got there i didn't really know you know i have no bearings by the way yeah you were tempted by too much fate i imagine yeah and it was it was raining and it was just like a bummer and i try i tried to find a place there all the places were pretty bleak and i just you know eventually i was like you know what fuck this and i bounced and i almost went back to la but then i wound up in this place called pangwich pangwich is like near zion national park or something i rented this a-frame cabin like big ass fucking Aspen-looking cabin thing. And I was like, this is a good idea. Yeah, I'll do this. And I got some groceries. I was like, I'll just be up here in the mountains here. Chalet lifestyle? Yeah, exactly. It was like the shining. It was like taxidermy animals everywhere. No other humans for 50 miles. It was horrible. Really bad idea. Lasted one night. Then I fucked off back to L.A. One night?

I couldn't do it. You bought groceries and it was one night? Oh, I couldn't do it. There was like every little sound. I was sleeping in front of this like 30-foot window. It was too much. That sounds terrible. It's the kind of place where you're supposed to go with 10 of your friends and we're all having some Molsons and we're going to go hit the slopes tomorrow kind of thing. Exactly. That's what it's supposed to be and that's not what it was. Instead, it was just... I watched Avengers Endgame. That's what put me to sleep. Bro, that's when you know it's bleak. This is one of the darkest stories I've ever heard. I have to be honest. I have to be honest. This is really fucking me up. So did you just go back to L.A. and go to studio like a normal person? No, I went back to L.A. for like two days. I went straight to Coachella. And I wasn't playing, so I was just going to Coachella to hang out, which I said to myself so many times, I'll never do that. and i did damn bro we were there too it was my first time this year i mean it was my whole life it's like i i i think i figured like if i can go to coachella and not smoke cigs there then i'm fucking clear and i went and i didn't so no okay okay so it was a yeah i guess wow a test of willpower if you could if you could not smoke cigs while watching you know your favorite band harry styles yeah exactly yeah i'm starting to see a trend here where you like to kind of up the ante and push it a little bit further, a little bit further, just to see what's next on our road rules challenge? Since then, now I don't do caffeine. No caffeine. No caffeine. So none of that. Bro, you're on your shit. I'm impressed. I'm a motorcycle guy now. That's the next. See, I'm like Brad Pitt, like a sober motorcycle guy. Okay, so have you and fellow Canadian Matty Matheson tangled across paths yet uh i know maddie yeah we used to play at his uh restaurant in toronto all the time like i mean this was a really really long time right right place called parts and labor yeah we used to play there yeah of course i'm just saying because there's a lot of

trends going on yeah he's a hog man he's a hog man he's a hog man but i've never seen him on a bike only on his instagram so i question the reality of all of it but that's a different podcast i saw i saw this cute like this cute video of him in toronto and he's riding around like a kawasaki klr like kind of a newer one he's talking about it and talking about they get out to the island i would love to i mean i love i love motorcycles it's so it's one of those things where i was like i don't give a fuck what the fuck am i gonna ride a motorcycle for fuck that shit fuck this and then i tried it and i was like holy fuck like this is so great and then we did the tour in august i did the whole fucking thing on a bike like fucking what it was amazing wait so you're saying the band the band was in like the sprinter of the bus and you just followed along on a motorcycle i would get up like two hours before everybody and like go it was all like california coast so i was just cruising down the one oh my god 90s bmw Holy shit. It's just – here's the thing. You drive in a car. You drive your car. You go somewhere beautiful. You have a nice time. You look at the window. You go, wow, that's beautiful. Look at this. Oh, I'm in the Redwood Forest. Okay. You're on a bike. All of a sudden, that experience you had in the car is like you were watching it on TV compared to the – how visceral and real you're not looking out the window you are the window exactly exactly it's fucking awesome so so you got into it later in life then what was your gateway like six months ago uh well okay so very late there is a band these kids uh you ever heard of this band called the garden yeah yeah yeah yeah so these are my good pals fly up wyatt and fletcher and um and they ride mopeds a lot they got mopeds and they were kind of like you should come riding i was like okay they got this moped gang

And I went and did that, and I was like, okay, this is pretty fun. So I got a moped, and I was like, okay, interesting. I got a kind of a shitty one. Those guys are way too hot and tall to be riding mopeds, but carry on. No, but the swag is that they deck themselves out like they're like Hell's Angels, kind of like badass leather, and then they're on the mopeds. It's a whole thing. I won't say too much because they like to keep it under the wraps a bit. Of course. But, yeah, I went and rode with them. And then I bought one and I was kind of fucked up. And I was like, okay, I'll fix this up. I know how to work on cars a little bit. And these things are tiny. So I rebuilt the whole engine and put in all this shit, all this stuff. And it was like, okay, I see. And then, you know, you just keep rolling down the line. And it's like, well, maybe I want to try something that goes a little bit faster. My friend Dan, he had just gotten a Yamaha XT600. And I was like, okay, well, you know, okay, okay. And then before I knew it, I had a dirt bike, and then I bought this old 70s BMW, and then I bought the one I did the tour on, and then I came back to L.A., and I found the same one that I bought the tour on, so I bought another one, and now I've got four bikes, and I love the fucking thing. Wow. Okay. Do you have somebody in your life who's telling you, i'm worried about your safety in any way they're everybody you tell people that you ride motorcycles and everybody goes like be careful yeah you know the one person that didn't do that i called my mom and i was like uh yeah hey mom like and she's like oh what are you doing i was like oh i'm riding bikes now and you know and she used to date this guy this guy named steve black and he was a harley guy so she used to ride his harley with him all the time assless chaps the whole thing all the all the fucking the gear You know, his house, Steve's house, too. When I was growing up, I remember going over there. His couch was like Harley Davidson brand. Committed. He'd have like Chrome Eagle statues and shit. He's married to it. Yeah, very married to it. So you call your mom and you're like, hey, you know, I've been riding motorcycles. And she's like, about time, pussy. Straight up. She was like, sweetheart, I think this is one of the best ideas you've had in a long time.

i was like right on my my boys become a man well because she knows she knows how great it is she knows how great it is she's felt felt the wind in her hair oh she's felt that wind and it's a good wind it's something that i've always really been interested into because i grew up riding bicycles and i love living life on two wheels but yeah i'm really extra tall and i'm just for some reason i'm like i don't know if i'm i don't want to like get into an emergency situation where like My knees hit the handlebars in some weird way, and I get tangled up. You'd be fine. We just get you the right bike. It'd be fine. It'd be fine. It's fully customizable, Jason. It's fully customizable. We'll get you some nice handlebars. What's the size on your body? How tall is it? 6'9". Wow, you're really tall. I'm a big fucker. Holy shit. You play basketball? No, I'm really bad at basketball. You know what, Mac? You know what, Mac? The way people assume that you smoke weed, they assume. Same thing with Jason in basketball. I see. I see. Same thing. Wasted talent. No, whatever. You know, fuck basketball. You should play hockey instead. He could become the next Wayne Gretzky. I make a great goalie. What do you know? I just stand there. I want to talk about it because I know that Matty, I've talked to Matty about this. I've made fun of him for this motorcycle thing because he buys all these parts. He has like a warehouse where he keeps all the parts that he buys. So are you having to rent property off-site to store stuff yet, or are we still working towards that? No, I kind of, I mean, I have like a patio. The good thing is I live in L.A., so it's like a net kind of, well, it's been raining recently, but it kind of never rains. So it's like I just have this patio zone with four bikes on it, and I have all the tools and this and that. I'm not trying to, I think Maddie dabbles a little more in kind of like the chopper. that's right kind of uh motorcycle which is like and that's cool but the whole you know premise of that is like let's buy parts and whack together like these insane bikes okay i just want to like buy these bikes make sure they run good and i'm more like you know like i drive one of those old toyota land cruisers like i like the like uh no no i drive the 90s one but it's like i want the uh

i want i just want it's it's like it's like wearing a fucking pair of car hearts or like a you know i want things of quality that will last a long time and that can go anywhere with the vehicles you know that's why i like these dual sports they're tangible yeah they're just good it's they're not digital no good quality repair them if they break absolutely learn how to repair them absolutely it's simple enough you know and it's good it's what a feeling how did you learn to to fix cars he's canadian it's in his blood i think to an extent but maybe i don't know i think uh jesus i think um i don't know i mean i'm not super good at it but i have this friend this friend dan he was here earlier today at my house and he just kind of knows how to do everything so it's like over covet i think especially he was like uh i was like let's do this or like oh man i wish i could do this and he'd be like well we can do that It's as simple as this. And I'd be like, okay. When Jason's trying to do something around the house, he's on YouTube or Reddit. You're calling Dan. He comes to the house. I'll do that a little bit. I think that the interesting thing is some of the stuff that I'm interested in fixing is so esoteric. Fixing old... music equipment and shit it's like yeah it's like maybe something on the internet but usually it's like you know the thing is it's it's not the info isn't super readily available but it's it's kind of like it's standardized across the board where like you know if you know how to work with a circuit board you know how to recap something or whatever you can look at a you know a circuit diagram then you're kind of good so it's like as soon as you learn those skills but um but yeah, I think, I don't know. It's the same. It's honestly, it's the same with, with car shit and bike shit. It's like you learn how to fucking take care of it, take care of a car, take care of an engine. It's like, they all kind of work the same way. It's like, you're just, it's like just a bunch of tiny explosions. That's it. I'm just impressed. I just feel like you have a guy, you, you still did it down. You do a lot of stuff, you know, you, it seems like you, do you ever just kick back and watch TV? Um, I'm pretty bad at watching like TV, TV, but I'll watch movies sometimes, but yeah, I'm,

I'm pretty bad at, I feel guilt for things like that. You know what I mean? Sometimes I'll be like, man, I just want to play a video game like I'm 12 again or something. And I feel guilt. when i do that like you're wasting your valuable time yeah but then but you know i find ways around it you know what i mean like even because everybody is like mac you should make a record you should make a write a song that's what you do you should do this i'm like no no no i'm gonna i'm gonna fix this music gear instead like even doing these things it's like it's a way to kind of get away from having to do the job that i you know make the money doing yeah or even you know like i'm saying with the video game thing it's like well i feel guilty playing the games but A couple years ago, I learned how to program them, so I was doing that, and it's like, well, now I can kind of get the essence of what I wanted to do, but it's like I'm being productive and making, quote-unquote, something artistic, but it's like, not really. I don't know. Yeah, it's like when I should be editing this podcast, but instead of watching TV, I'm going to do the dishes again today, and that's something very productive, and I shouldn't feel guilty about that. even though it's well i mean exactly at least you guys just aren't on twitter all day it could be worse yeah yeah that's no that's i think that's probably the ultimate waste of time but you know whatever fuck you okay well mac as as a as a sober person how has that changed your your life i mean like a touring musician been all over the world How do you vacation? I can't do it. I'm so bad at doing it. You can't do it. My man. My man. You're back. We're friends again. I can't do it. I go somewhere. I always have to have a little studio set up with me or something just so I can be like, I can't chill like that. I don't know. You can't just turn all the way off.

No, like even this trip that I did this record on, it's like I kind of just wanted to leave and go see people and do whatever, you know, kind of a vacation. But I was like, nah, instead I'm going to bring like a full studio set up and I'll record all the time. It's like, you know, and in that way, it's like I didn't even know if I was going to put this shit out because it's just like, what is this weird instrumental thing? It's just kind of like the soundtrack to my three-month vacation. Did you play it for people and they're like, you have to put this out? Or were you like, fuck it, I did it, I might as well put it out? I played it for a couple people. I think that, you know, I've entered into kind of a pocket of maybe my – I'm beginning to make things that are not for everybody, I don't think. Sure, sure, sure, sure. I know the people that it'll – and the kinds of people that I'm contemporary with and that I admire or whatever, I know that they'll be on my page with it. But there's a couple of people that were like, whoa, this is really cool. And then I'll show it to, you know, there's a lot of people in L.A. that are, like, very much in the industry and have the, you know, they're kind of like, what do you mean there's no lyrics on this? What are you talking about? How does that work? I'm kind of like, well, you know. How am I supposed to sell this? Yeah, exactly. I think that, you know, even my label and the people that work with me were like, Max, we're trying something. It's a little bit outside the box. It's kind of like, you know, it's just a whole bunch of dog shit. You know, it's like. I don't know. I think it's – why not? It's funny that publications and people are treating it like it's my next quote-unquote record. It's like, oh, he's back after four years. It's like, not really. I just drove around and recorded some stuff, and you can have and listen to it if you want, but if you don't, I really honestly don't give a fuck. It's out there. Yeah, it's out there, and it's – It's out there if you want to listen to it. And I like it. I think it's cool, and I think I'm glad that I shared it with everybody, but it's like – yeah, it's just a funny little thing. But I think that's the whole – even that.

uh like i'm talking about becoming more free of things and it's like you know i'd love to become more free of the music industry because it's filled with complete fucking morons and it's just horrible it's a horrible place yeah and there's you know like we're saying nobody's cool anymore and everybody's just drinking the kool-aid on this like dog shit music and it's like i yeah i just don't want to i don't want to play so maybe this is my step in the direction of like you know Well, I'm going to keep putting out weird shit. Well, you know what's going to happen, Mac. You know what's going to happen. You're going to put out three weird records, and then they're going to call you a genius, and it's all going to happen again. You're going to have to deal with these motherfuckers no matter what. They love this. They love this shit. As long as I can just be in my little pocket and be comfortable in my little pocket with it, then that would be fine. You do seem like you've... like carved out an interesting career i feel like you've earned the right to do this you know what i'm saying yeah yeah and it's i'm lucky too where you know i got money i got you know things are fine we can play shows if we want it's like i'm not worried about that side of it so it's like nice to just do whatever the fuck i want to do it's a lower pressure situation you can make the record on your own and give it to your bro who can mix it and master it or maybe you do that yourself i mean i've always done that all of the you know everything i've ever done has just been me pretty much which is like it's good i was actually that's funny i was looking at the uh the grammys the grammy thing today uh with like the everybody because the grammys are coming up and i got these two kids these kids jd and domi i sang on their song they're up for a grammy anyway so i was looking because i don't even know what day it is but you look at the credits on these like it's like Beyonce's performance or like this, you know, whatever. It's like some album. It's 22 names. Oh, more than that. It's like a fucking paragraph full of names. You know what I was kind of pleasantly surprised by is I looked at all this and all of the contenders are like this huge chunk of...

all these people doing shit. But then I looked at Harry Styles' album, and it was kind of a modest list. It was like, okay, the band and some engineers and a producer. It was kind of small. And I was like, that's weird. That's because Harold Stylish is a real one, Mac. And I hope you believe that. And if you don't, maybe you'll come around one day. I don't know about old... I don't know. He's cute. I'll tell him that. He's very sexy. And he's got nice hair and a nice body. And I admire these things. Yeah, actually, I understand that. I'm glad you found something for you. You found something for yourself. And I've seen all these videos. He's got all these videos of him talking to the crowd at his shows. And it seems, yeah, he seems like he's... I don't know, he's always saying something funny or somebody throws something funny up there. I can get behind. You know what? Yeah, I'm a Harry Styles fan. I love Harry Styles. He's my favorite artist. Yeah, the show is quite, he's very good with the crowd. He really puts on a show. Everybody can agree on that. Speaking of live shows, have you thought about if you are or how you are going to play this album live in front of a crowd? Yeah, well, I mean, I probably, it's either, we might do a couple of like little uh shows i think i would do like maybe like six or six to ten shows where we just play this record we don't play any of the other songs it's kind of like evening with you come in it's kind of cute we're sitting down i don't know maybe it'd be fucking candles burning or something you know and i could record it we could put out a live record of it i i'm playing with that idea but it's also like um even that like doing that like i was just saying how the music industry is stupid like even the live music shit that's going on right now is ridiculous it's like everyone's like well if you want to play we have to you know we have to book it two years in advance and blah blah blah it's all this shit so it's like well don't expect me to don't expect me to pay 500 plus fees for a mac to marco ticket don't get any ideas oh no no no no no no here's the thing i put anything out there for like more than 30 bucks and my fans like you son of a bitch you like even a hoodie i mean the hoodies i think

I think the hoodie is still pretty cheap. We're doing new hoodies. I don't know how much they're going to be. But we did these figurines two Christmases ago. And they were handmade porcelain figurines and painted, painted, hand painted. You know, there was like 50 of them. It took this guy in San Francisco like forever to make these things, you know. And they're beautiful. And we put them up for like 100 bucks a pop or something. And the kids were like, you son of a bitch. Like, I can't believe you. And it was just like. give me a fucking break you know it's like so you're saying i'm doing this you're saying your fans would have paid a hundred dollars like i'm not even making money off of this i mean that the reality is like if we did this tour for this record it was like eight shows and i had to put do a kind of a you know i don't know even with a higher ticket price a little bit higher than normal like i still like my tickets be like 20 bucks but if i had to do 30 or 40 like Yeah, we probably wouldn't make any money on it. But it would be fun. Maybe we could make money off the live record. Probably not. I don't know. Fuck it. I already got money. Fuck money. Cool guys. Cool guys don't care about money. And that's what I'm doing, baby. I'm getting cool again. I'm going to save rock and roll. That's what I'm talking about. Mac, I mean, that's a beautiful place to end it. It really is. God bless you. God bless you. Thank you so much for taking the time to chat with us. And everybody out there, make sure you go. Grab his new record and give it a listen. I think it's a really special thing, and I'm curious to see it live. I can't wait to hear the sped-up version for TikTok. I can't wait to hear the Chopped Screwed version. I can't wait to hear the version where Steve Lacey sings on it. The list goes on. Yeah, Mac, send us the stems when you get a second. We really appreciate it. Absolutely. All right, my friend. We appreciate you, and we'll see you on the reservoir, bro. Absolutely. I'll see you soon. Thanks for having me. We'll talk to you soon, bro. Our pleasure.